Arthur August NIEMANN^302,1107 was born on 7 May 1876 in Bendigo Vic - then known as City of Sandhurst - Forest Hill.¹¹⁰⁸ In 1915 he was a Foundryman. He died of T.B. [age 40yrs ] on 24 August 1916 in Melbourne Vic - Hampton. Arthur was buried after 24 August 1916 in Bendigo Vic.¹¹⁰⁹ The grave is located on the Western side of Lavender Walk. It is the 8th Grave from the Southern End. (one of the 7 previous graves is a double). The grave is unmarked. Grave : F1 Lavender Walk 23282 (no headstone) [Photo] Arthur August's life is described in some detail in the Niemann family book p 82. Parents: Johannn August "John" NIEMANN-56 and Living.

Spouse: Mabel Inglis DICKSON (NIEMANN)-1664. Mabel Inglis DICKSON (NIEMANN) and Arthur August NIEMANN were married on 16 November 1904 in Melbourne Vic - St Andrew's Church, Carlton. A clock maker in Adelaide contacted Grant Niemann, who directed him to Trent Niemann. He had in his possession a clock which had been presented to Arthur August, by his work mates on the occasion of his marriage in 1904.
It is assumed that his brother who lived in Adelaide for some time 'inherited' the clock and at some time it had been disposed of into the marketplace.
Trent Niemann selected at random names from the White Pages for Victoria, sent off three letters ' just on spec' . Scott Niemann telephoned Trent and said he was related to Arthur August and that his father William Maxwell was a grandson of Arthur August.
Subsequently William 'Bill' Niemann contacted Trent by telephone. He says he remembers the clock. We exchanged a few bits'n pieces of family history. He was going to follow-up on the clock. Children were: Norma Edith NIEMANN-1665, Henry August "Harry" NIEMANN-1666, William Arthur NIEMANN-1667.

Arthur August NIEMANN was born on 27 December 1907 in unknown place. He died on 3 April 1993 in Bendigo probably. He was buried after 3 April 1993 in Bendigo Vic. Grave : N5 Grave No 30246 [photo] Parents: Frederick Conrad "Fred" NIEMANN-105 and Ethel Emily May HARDING (NIEMANN)-1673.

Spouse: Frances Edith Georgina "Ena" WIRTH (NIEMANN)-2411. Frances Edith Georgina "Ena" WIRTH (NIEMANN) and Arthur August NIEMANN were married in 1932 in unknown place. Children were: Living, Graham Arthur NIEMANN-2413, Living.

Arthur James "Art" NIEMANN^1110,1111 was born on 3 June 1903 in Broken Hill NSW.^{109,1112,1113} He was a Jockey. He died in 1952 in Sydney NSW - possibly.^1111,1114 Art was buried in 1952 in Sydney NSW - possibly. Centennial Park Adelaide possbible - no dates given - Age: 51 Years Interment Details: Burial Section: Anglican B Row: Path: BJ Site: 304 Licence Number: 8801 Licence Expiry Date: 02/04/2005

Parents: William John NIEMANN-37 and Emily Edith May "Edith" SPRATT (NIEMANN)-194.

Spouse: Doreen May SALMON (NIEMANN)-1674. Doreen May SALMON (NIEMANN) and Arthur James "Art" NIEMANN were married about 1923 in Broken Hill NSW - possibly.

Arthur William George 'Boof' NIEMANN^1115,1116 was born on 13 October 1924 in Broken Hill NSW.^1115,1117 He was a Bar Steward. He died on 5 December 1988 in Broken Hill NSW. Arthur was buried on 7 December 1988 in Broken Hill NSW. 'Relative M V Niemann 75 Morgan St, Broken Hill' 'Age at death 64 years' Grave : Broken Hill Ang Sec ZC R7 Gr 15 [Photo]¹¹¹⁸
Parents: Lewis "Lew / Lou" NIEMANN-198 and Doreen Mary ROBINSON (NIEMANN)-244.

Spouse: Living. Children were: Living, Living, Living, Living.

Carrie NIEMANN was born in 1883 in Victoria - Richmond.¹¹¹⁹ Parents: Sarah Annie NIEMANN-1653.

Cecil Conrad NIEMANN^328,1120 was born in 1898 in Broken Hill NSW.¹¹²¹ He was a Wood cutter. He died on 2 September 1962 in Broken Hill NSW.^1122,1123 It appears from the reports Cecil died alone. His body discovered by a friend. Cecil was buried after 5 September 1962 in Broken Hill NSW. Grave : Gen BA Row 5 G 20 (no headstone) [Photo]¹¹²⁴ Uncle Cecil was a bachelor all of his life. The Niemann Family book provides some commentary but apart from family gatherings he was something of an illusive figure.
Unfortunately most of the stories about him revolve around his liking for a beer too many.
One Christmas morning he arrived at our place 'under the weather' and as his mother was due to arrive for lunch my father installed him on a couch in the back garden to 'sleep it off'. Grandma arrived earlier than expected and from time to time noted she had not seen Cecil, but he was due for lunch. Cecil awoke still the worse for wear and there was a valiant but failed attempt to ply Cecil with coffee and 'tidy him up'. Grandma discovered him and wasn't too happy about his condition. and let him know in no uncertain terms.
He regularly drank at the Newmarket hotel. He always sat by the window. I'd discovered that if I sidled up to the window for a 'chat' he'd always give me money for an icecream. Unfortunately my father discovered my little ploy and I was grounded for some weeks and my visits to Uncle Cecil were banned ! (Trent Niemann) Parents: Ernest James NIEMANN-8 and Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN)-9.

Christian NIEMANN¹¹²⁵ was born on 17 February 1835 in GERMANY - Bremen. He immigrated on 31 October 1846 to Adelaide SA. He lived in NEW ZEALAND in 1860. Went to NZ with two of his brothers in 1860's and returned to Australia about 1867.
One daughter was known as- Mrs May - Sydney (Husband in fur hat business)
not sure of given name but was either Lucy or Illma
Christian lived in Bendigo Vic - California Gully, Windmill Hill in 1861. According to the Bendigo Bibliography, Christian played cricket for 'The Bachelor's Cricket Club at head of California Gully " It seems he may have also been involved in a race [ assumed footrace] at Myers Flat on 22/12/1861.
He was No. 1862 on the electoral roll. As an adult 16/9/1868 he lived at California Gully. He was a Miner. He held the following mining claims: New Chance Co. & Flyblow 320 Yards.
In 1859 in Bendigo the following signed a petition for better Goldfield conditions, August Niemann Cristian John John Henry John Henry Jnr James Devine Thomas Devine . All were listed as miners.
He lived in Bendigo Vic - Ironbark Alley St. in 1873. Christian died aged 53yrs in 1885 in Melbourne Vic - Collingwood.¹¹²⁶ He was buried in 1885/6 in Melbourne Vic - probably.
Parents: Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN-49 and Tobete Margrete OSTERMANN (NIEMANN)-50.

Spouse: Charlotte JENKINSON (NIEMANN)-1649. Charlotte JENKINSON (NIEMANN) and Christian NIEMANN were married on 7 December 1861 in Bendigo Vic - [AKA Sandhurst] - St Andrews Presbyterian Manse.^770,771 Marriage witnessed by Johann Diedrich Conrad Niemann (brother/ brother-in-law). Children were: Lucy NIEMANN (WINSTANLEY)-1652, Sarah Annie NIEMANN-1653, Illma NIEMANN-1655, John Ernst Christian NIEMANN-1654, Eleanor Victoria Margaret NIEMANN ( WINWOOD)-4615, Ruby NIEMANN-4616.

Christian NIEMANN¹¹²⁷ was born on 8 June 1867 in NEW ZEALAND. He died of General Debility on 19 May 1868 in Bendigo Vic - Forest St.. He was buried on 20 May 1868 in Bendigo Vic.¹¹²⁸ Christian & August William Niemann buried in the same grave C of E B 3 Open.
Grave : C of E B3 3019 [no headstone]¹¹²⁹ Parents: Johannn August "John" NIEMANN-56 and Living.

Clement Edward NIEMANN was born in 1896 in Stawell Vic.¹¹³⁰ He died in 1963 in Heidelberg Vic.¹¹³¹ He was buried in 1963 in Melbourne probably. Parents: John Ernst Christian NIEMANN-1654 and Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN)-4754.

Delcie NIEMANN^328,1132 was born in 1910 in Broken Hill NSW. She died on 7 April 1913 in Broken Hill NSW.^{328,1132,1133,1134} She was buried after 7 April 1913 in Broken Hill NSW.¹¹³³ Grave : Broken Hill Ang Sec Z Gr 49 (no headstone)¹¹³⁵ Surname spelled incorrectly " NEIMANN" in cemetery records Broken Hill. Parents: Ernest James NIEMANN-8 and Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN)-9.

Diedrich Conrad (Jr) "Ricky" NIEMANN¹¹³⁶ was born on 29 September 1867 in Eaglehawk Vic.^1137,1138 Bendigo Biographical indicates his birth as 29/1/1867, however his baptism date 4/11/1867 would suggest otherwise. He was baptized on 4 November 1867 in Bendigo Vic - St Killian's. Baptism witnesses were Patrick & Margaret Nolan. He was a Miner. Ricky died in 1910 in WA - Shark Bay - Drowned at sea.¹¹³⁹ The story of his presumed death is outlined in the Niemann Family history book. "Drowned between Broome & Shark Bay (suspected foul play)"
He was buried in 1910 in WA - Shark Bay. Grave : WA Shark Bay Drowned at sea Parents: Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN-26 and Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN)-27.

Eileen Jane NIEMANN^328,1140 was born in 1901 in Broken Hill NSW.¹¹⁴¹ She died before 30 October 1905 in Broken Hill NSW.¹¹⁴² She was buried on 30 October 1905 in Broken Hill NSW. Grave : Broken Hill - Ang Sec Z Gr 49 (no row no / no headstone)¹¹⁴³ Parents: Ernest James NIEMANN-8 and Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN)-9.

Ernest James NIEMANN^{1144,1145,1146} was born on 12 April 1874 in Eaglehawk Vic - assumed. His gravestone claims he was 79 yrs at death. The dates here indicate 80 yrs. His birth date may be incorrect. He was baptized on 1 March 1875 in Bendigo Vic - St Killian's. William Hogan & Jane Nolan were witnesses to his baptism. He lived woodyard owner, miner, Council employee in Broken Hill NSW - 709 Beryl St, in 1954. Ernest died (Death Date Uncertain) before 11 June 1954 in Broken Hill NSW.^1147,1148 He was buried on 11 June 1954 in Broken Hill NSW. Grave : Broken Hill - Gen AR R B3 G 18 [Photo]¹¹⁴⁹ Ernest James is remembered as a kindly Grandfather. He was quite young when his father died as did several of his siblings. It is difficult to understand the reason for his mother moving the family from Eaglehawk to Broken Hill. The towns do have mining as a common element but there is a world of difference between the two. Broken Hill at that time was a desolate and difficult place in which to live. It is possible that there were other members of the family who also moved to Broken Hill, but as yet no links have been uncovered. In modern times it is not difficult to understand people moving long distances but the challenges in those days must have been enormous. Parents: Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN-26 and Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN)-27.

Spouse: Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN)-9. Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN) and Ernest James NIEMANN were married on 1 January 1896.³⁵⁸ Children were: Cecil Conrad NIEMANN-59, Lily Irene NIEMANN (RUSSELL)-60, Eileen Jane NIEMANN-61, Beryl NIEMANN (NIEMANN)-225, Ernest Richard NIEMANN-63, Eileen NIEMANN (LAKE)-64, Delcie NIEMANN-65, Harry NIEMANN-2, Leslie "Les" NIEMANN-66, Zella Margaret NIEMANN (MCPHEE)-67.

Ernest Richard NIEMANN^1150,1151 was born on 25 January 1906 in Broken Hill NSW.¹¹⁵² He was a Railway fettler. He died as the result of a railway 'trike' accident on 15 June 1942 in Rota NSW.¹¹⁵³ Ernest was buried on 17 June 1942 in Hillston NSW.^{1154,1155,1156} Grave : RC Reference Lost The records for numerous burials in Hillston have been lost. Parents: Ernest James NIEMANN-8 and Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN)-9.

Spouse: Eileen Isabel IVY CLARK (NIEMANN)-138. Eileen Isabel IVY CLARK (NIEMANN) and Ernest Richard NIEMANN were married in 1929. Children were: Maxwell Ernest "Max" NIEMANN-139, Living, Living, Living.

Ernst NIEMANN was born in 1893 in Collingwood Vic.¹¹⁵⁷ He died in 1893 in Collingwood Vic.¹¹⁵⁸ He was buried in 1893 in Melbourne probably. Parents: John Ernst Christian NIEMANN-1654 and Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN)-4754.

Eva Isabella NIEMANN was born in 1903 in Carlton Vic.¹¹⁵⁹ She died before 2003. Parents: John Ernst Christian NIEMANN-1654 and Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN)-4754.

Franz NIEMANN was born on 22 April 1878 in Sale Vic.¹¹⁰⁴ He died [at birth] on 12 May 1878 in Sale Vic [ not registered ]. He was buried about 12 May 1878 in Sale Vic - probably. Parents: Johannn August "John" NIEMANN-56 and Living.

Franz Wilhelm NIEMANN was born estimated 1770 in GERMANY - Bremen probably. Estimated 1796 he was a Town workman. He died on 16 May 1805 in GERMANY - Bremen.⁹²⁷ Franz was buried in GERMANY - Bremen - assumed. Just out of interest ..... Niemann, Bremen
Neptun Line / Dampfschifffahrts Gesellschaft Neptun 1873-1974 Bremen

Formed by Johann Hermann Niemann and others in 1873 the Dampfschiffahrts Gesellschaft Neptun started operations with six ships from Bremen to Norway, Sweden, Denmark and the German Baltic ports. In 1875 a service from Bremen to Rotterdam and Amsterdam was started and in 1877 a Bremen Hamburg service was begun, the company expanded rapidly and new liner services were opened to the Mediterranean, Spain and Portugal.

In the first World War DG Neptun operated only in the Baltic Area. DG Neptun started World War I with seventy-six steamships, when the war ended only fifty six ships were left.

In the years 1920, 1921 and 1922 the company started the liner service again, which had been closed down at the beginning of World War I. The first motorship the GAUSS entered the fleet in 1925. During the civil war in Spain (1936-1939) the liner service to Spain was stopped.

At the beginning of World War II, the DG Neptun fleet consisted of seventy-one ships, however, by the end of the war only thirteen ships remained. The Bremen West Sweden service was started again in 1948, followed in 1949 to Spain and Portugal. The motorship LIBELLE was the first post war new building for the fleet. By 1950 several liner services were recommenced.

DG Neptun became Sloman Neptun Schiffahrts-Aktiengesellschaft in 1974 after the Sloman Group bought a 75% holding.

Many thanks to Henk Jungerius and Ted Finch for their assistance in collecting this data. The following list was extracted from various sources. This is not an all inclusive list but should only be used as a guide. If you would like to know more about a vessel, visit the Ship Descriptions (onsite) or Immigrant Ship web site.

Parents: .

Spouse: Anna Rebecca KÖRNS (NIEMANN)-52. Anna Rebecca KöRNS (NIEMANN) and Franz Wilhelm NIEMANN were married estimated 1795 in GERMANY - Bremen - assumed.^927,928 Children were: Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN-49, Anna Elizabeth Margaretha NIEMANN (JACOBSEN)-4965, Fredrich Nicolaus NIEMANN-4966.

Frederick Conrad "Fred" NIEMANN¹¹⁶⁰ was born on 11 September 1879 in Sale Vic.¹¹⁶¹ In 1903/4 he was a Fruiterer in Bendigo Vic - Golden Square,High St.. In 1915 he was a Grocery store owner - High Street in Bendigo Vic. He owned businesses in and around Bendigo, was a member of the Bendigo City Council and in 1932 became Mayor of Bendigo.
Sands&McDougall postal directory listing Niemann Bros - Grocers in 1908 at 282 Myrtle St Cnr of Violet St. Bendigo. ( from sue Kelly) The Niemann street in Bendigo named after him;[ althougn, as a street it is not exactly a main thoroughfare! ] In 1932 Fred was a Mayor in Bendigo Vic. In 1932 Frederick conrad Niemann became Mayor of Bendigo.
The Niemann street in Bendigo is almost certainly named after hime; althougn, as a street it is not exactly a main thoroughfare!
"The successful candidate was F.C. Niemann who had three previous unsuccessful contests." c 1932 Bendigo library records
"F.C. Niemann opposed two & half days for the Bendigo race"
"OnMonday Dec 26th, an official welcome was extended to the returnees by the Mayor Cr. F.C. Niemann who subsequently opened the Gala week"
"The Moderator General of the Presbyterian Church was accorded a civic reception by the Mayor, Cr. Niemann." He died [age 67 yrs ] on 5 August 1947 in Bendigo Vic - Kennington. He was buried on 7 August 1947 in Bendigo Vic.¹¹⁶² Grave : Ind MON A 4 Priv Grave No. 34528 Ref 8436 [photo] Parents: Johannn August "John" NIEMANN-56 and Living.

Spouse: Ethel Emily May HARDING (NIEMANN)-1673. Ethel Emily May HARDING (NIEMANN) and Frederick Conrad "Fred" NIEMANN were married in 1905. Children were: Frederick Raymond "Ray" NIEMANN-2401, Arthur August NIEMANN-2402, Alan Thomas NIEMANN-2403, Living, Living.

Frederick Raymond "Ray" NIEMANN was born on 10 February 1906 in unknown place. Between 1932 and 1966 he was a Teacher in Vic.⁵⁴⁹ Found by accident: Dame Mary Gilmore Papers National Library of Australia MS 1695 Folder 7 http://nla.gov.au/nla.ms-ms1695
"Copy of a song: a tribute to the memory of Gilmore. The poem was written by her, and the music was by F.R. Niemann. "
He served in the military between 1939 and 1945 in Moartai 1945 ; Ambon 1945.¹¹⁶³ Ray died before 2006. Parents: Frederick Conrad "Fred" NIEMANN-105 and Ethel Emily May HARDING (NIEMANN)-1673.

Spouse: Shiela Mary MAHER (NIEMANN)-2406. Shiela Mary MAHER (NIEMANN) and Frederick Raymond "Ray" NIEMANN were married on 12 March 1951 in unknown place. Children were: Living.

Fredrich Nicolaus NIEMANN was born on 3 November 1803 in GERMANY - Bremen.¹¹⁶⁴ "Bermerkungen [ Notes]
Konfession [Religion] LU
getauft: 6 Nov 1803, getauft in Bremen
TZ Johann Nicolaus Kaars "

Parents: Franz Wilhelm Niemann +16.05.1805 Bremen [ death presumed]
Anna Rebecca KoRN *1744 in Appel = Helvensiek + 29.9.1836 in Bremen

No children found for Fredrich Nicholas

Siblings:
Johann Heinrich Niemann 1799 in Bremen
Anna Elizabeth Margaretha Niemann 1801 in Bremen He was baptized on 6 November 1803 at St Peters Cathedral in GERMANY - Bremen.¹¹⁶⁵ [page 271, section 4, Anno 1803 den 6ten Novb.]
6th November
Friedrich Nicolaus Niemann, ehel. geb. den
3ten und get. den 6ten Nov., der Vater Franz Wil-
3rd November
helm Niemann, ein Arbeitsmann die Mutter
working man
Anna Rebecka Körns; Gevatter Johann
God father
Nicolaus Körn.

6th November 1803
Friedrich Nicholaus Niemann
Born: 3rd November 1803
Baptised: 6th November 1803
Father: Franz Wilhelm Niemann, Working man
Mother: Anna Rebecca nee Körns
Godfather: Johann Nicholaus Körn
He died before 1903 in Unknown. Probable Error : Records from Church of Our Lady, burials list a death "Jan 2nd. Franz Wm. son Niemann third age 2 2 1/4 (2.25 ) Groten 30" Strongly suggested that the child is Frederich Nicholas, 3rd child of Franz Wilhelm & Rebecca KoRNS. Parents: Franz Wilhelm NIEMANN-51 and Anna Rebecca KÖRNS (NIEMANN)-52.

Graham Arthur NIEMANN was born in 1935. He died in 1935 in Bendigo Vic. He was buried on 2 August 1935 in Bendigo Vic.¹¹⁶⁶ Grave : Grave No. 30246 Meth N5 Open [photo] Parents: Arthur August NIEMANN-2402 and Frances Edith Georgina "Ena" WIRTH (NIEMANN)-2411.

Harry NIEMANN^{1167,1168,1169} was born on 13 December 1915 in Broken Hill NSW. He lived woodyard worker, miner, Mining Engineer in Broken Hill NSW between 1915 and 1958. As a young man he worked in his father's woodyard, not the best place for an asthmatic. However he was always very skilled with an axe! Eventually he joined the north Mine as a miner where he worked underground for several years. He began studying at about 27 years of age; a challenge for somebody who had left school at 14 years of age. Over the years he became a Surveyor, Geologist and finally an Engineer. It took him until he was 36 years old to achieve his qualifications. Between 1927 and 1968 he was a Mining engineer / Civil Engineer in Broken Hill NSW. Harry lived Engineer in Charge, Department of Main Roads in Wentworth NSW between 1959 and 1963. He was responsible for the supervision of the construction of the 'new' Wentworth to Broken Hill road (to about half way) and the sealing of that road. He was similarly involved in the construction of the Buronga NSW to Balranald NSW reconstruction and sealing.
He traversed the roads many times and his knowledge of Geology gave him an insight into the sources of both water and sand in otherwise clay covered country.
From time to time his family travelled with him while he was working but he never mentioned, but maybe he didn't know, that his relatives had lived in Balranald and around Pooncarie . This fact has only been uncovered since the two histories of the Nolan and Niemann families were written.
Similarly visits to Bendigo & Eaglehawk on family holidays were without reference to his familiy history. He held the qualification of Diploma in Metalliferous Mining Engineering He lived Supervising Engineer, Department of Main Roads NSW in Parkes NSW between 1964 and 1966. Harry lived Supervising Engineer (maintenance) Dept of Main Roads in Sydney NSW between 1966 and 1968. His work in Sydney was most interesting and included the maintenance of the Sydney Harbour Bridge which provided the opportunity for his sons to climb to the top (for free ! ). He also had involvement with the Captain Cook and Gladesville bridges and the Northern Expressway. He died on 22 April 1968 in Sydney NSW.¹¹⁷⁰ A history of Asthma, which was largely untreated throughout his youth and growing years, smoking, Broken Hill dust and other occupational hazards led to his early demise. He largely ignored advice regarding his health and eventually his heart gave up the struggle. He was buried about 22 April 1968 in Sydney NSW - Macquarie Fields. Grave : Macquarie Fields North Ryde RC Grv 9 Row 47 Vaughan [Photo] Harry Niemann, had a passion for Geology and spent many hours wandering the hills around Broken Hill or anywhere he travelled. He could find water in an apparently dry creek beds, loved camping, fishing and restoring what was an old house. He regularly visited the town dump to collect broken concrete paving to create a 'crazy paving' patio alongside the house. Under the 'direction' of wife Molly he created doorways, windows, rooms and other various home comforts. The house at 634 Blende St., has been demolished but the old shed / workshop remained in 2005.
He was an asthmatic, smoker and non-drinker (until about 1960) and during the Broken Hill dust storms he struggled to breathe.
He was a strong disciplinarian but very rarely used the 'belt' when he was angry, and generally when used it was well deserved. Visions still exist of him sitting at the Kitchen table demanding the boys eat 'what was put in front of them ' and from time to time he's have the 'belt' around his neck ... he was serious. And sometimes the cooking wasn't great ! However, he cared greatly for his family and loved to pass on information, opinions etc. about life and the world in general. He was a good teacher, never getting frustrated but extremely persistent. One could never forget Pythagorus' Theorum, nor would he allow it not to be learned !
He learn many lessons from living during the 1930's economic depression and related that the family often ate rabbit, potaoes and onions day in and day out while living on the banks of the Murray at Merbein in a bag hut.
He had a passion about the value of Education, enjoyed family both immediate and extended. He was intolerant of immorality, dishonesty etc. his wrath was greatest when such principles were breached. He had high regard for and showed respect for immigrants, probably because he saw them as good honest workers.
Harry was a tolerable musician and loved to sing, play the mouth organ and struggle with the button accordian and from time to time the banjo. This love came to the fore around the camp fire on the Darling river where a family group would sit around singing mainly Irish songs. The old Irish song 'Danny Boy' is a warm reminder of Harry Niemann.
Parents: Ernest James NIEMANN-8 and Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN)-9.

Spouse: Living. Children were: Living, Living.

Henry August "Harry" NIEMANN¹¹⁷¹ was born on 8 August 1908 in Melbourne Vic - Carlton.³⁰² About 1935 he was an Orchardist in Swan Hill Vic - assumed. He died on 17 January 1984 in Swan Hill - possibly. Harry was buried after 17 January 1984 in Swan Hill Vic.. Grave : Swan Hill Parents: Arthur August NIEMANN-103 and Mabel Inglis DICKSON (NIEMANN)-1664.

Spouse: Edith Mary MCLEAN (NIEMANN)-1668. Edith Mary MCLEAN (NIEMANN) and Henry August "Harry" NIEMANN were married in 1935. Children were: Living, Living, Living, Pamela Joy "Twin" NIEMANN-2540, Living.

Illma NIEMANN was born in 1872 in unknown place. She is ASSUMED ( a calculated guess), to have died before 1972 in Melbourne Vic - possibly Parents: Christian NIEMANN-55 and Charlotte JENKINSON (NIEMANN)-1649.

Iris Hellen NIEMANN was born in 1906 in Carlton Vic.¹¹⁷² She died before 2006. Parents: John Ernst Christian NIEMANN-1654 and Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN)-4754.

Jack William NIEMANN was born on 23 May 1992 in Bendigo probably. He died on 26 May 1992 in Bendigo probably. He was buried after 26 May 1992 in Eaglehawk Vic. Parents: Living and Living.

James Henry NIEMANN^1139,1173 was born on 10 February 1882 in Eaglehawk Vic - Jobs Gully. He died on 26 April 1883 in Eaglehawk Vic - California Gully, Near Shellback Engine. He was buried on 26 April 1883 in Eaglehawk Vic.¹¹⁷⁴ A day of tragedy for Rose Anne and her surviving children. James Henry died on the same day as his father; and is buried with him. Grave : Same grave A2/242 ; with Father, GFather and unknown Rosanna EYRE¹¹⁷⁵ Information Source: P129 A Niemann family history.
Died on the same day as his father!
He was buried on the same day as his father.

[The book Shamrocks to Wattle Nolan Family 1853-1998 says in error that he died a month after his father on 25/04/1883 ]

Parents: Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN-26 and Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN)-27.

Jenny May* NIEMANN¹⁰⁹⁷ was born on 12 February 1933 in Broken Hill NSW.^48,1097 She died on 17 February 1933 in Broken Hill NSW.¹¹⁷⁶ She was buried on 18 February 1933 in Broken Hill NSW. Grave : Broken Hill - METH M5 46 44¹¹⁷⁷ Parents: William Henry (Bill) NIEMANN-196 and Beryl NIEMANN (NIEMANN)-225.

Johann August "[Stillborn]" NIEMANN was born in 1833 in GERMANY - Bremen. Jessie Cafiso "A Niemann Family history " only referred to this child in the notes as his name is identical to a later child. He died in 1833 in GERMANY - Bremen. Parents: Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN-49 and Tobete Margrete OSTERMANN (NIEMANN)-50.

Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN^1136,1173 was born on 3 October 1838 in GERMANY - Bremen.¹¹⁷³ He immigrated in October 1846. Arrived in Adelaide with his parents and family on the 'Heerjeebhoy Rustomjee Patel' He was a Miner. Johann died on 23 March 1883 in Eaglehawk Vic - Tuburcular Asthma. He was buried on 26 April 1883 in Eaglehawk Vic. His remains are in an unmarked grave at Eaglehawk Cemetery. It is unfortunate that no headstone or recognition of his burial place remains.
Bendigo Cemetery Trust claims burial 26/4/1883 but I have death 23/3/1883 ! Grave : A2 /242 same grave as his Father [Photo]¹¹⁷⁸ ¹¹⁷⁹ Jan 2010: A cemetery record for Frederick Hylton Niemann Meth M4 Row Q Grave 4 18/10/1913 1 year Ref 23913 discovered. However I cannot find a connection. The Child's parents were Niemann Frederick & Mary Jane nee Johnston ( m 1911 Broken Hill 8716/1911) . It is possible Frederick was the son of an Arthur Niemann and was born in Adelaide. It is also possible that Mary Jane died 15444/1952 Marrickville. Included for possible future reference . There is little information regarding Johann Diedrich Conrad apart from facts related to his birth, marriage etc. He died at a relatively young age and the family left Bendigo for Broken Hill following his death. The Niemann book has a few more details but little of an anecdotal nature which gives few clues regarding his personality. Parents: Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN-49 and Tobete Margrete OSTERMANN (NIEMANN)-50.

Spouse: Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN)-27. Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN) and Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN were married on 24 August 1862 in Bendigo Vic - Fourth White Hill (Rites of Congregationalist. Witnesses Sister Lucy Niemann (Devine) & Lucy's Husband Thomas Devine
Children were: Margaret JULIA NIEMANN (HORTHUM) (KITCHENMASTER)-32, Anne Mary NIEMANN-33, John NIEMANN-34, Michael Henry NIEMANN-35, Diedrich Conrad (Jr) "Ricky" NIEMANN-36, William John NIEMANN-37, Anne "Annie" NIEMANN (SPRATT)-38, Ernest James NIEMANN-8, Sarah Jane Frances NIEMANN-39, John August NIEMANN-40, James Henry NIEMANN-41.

Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN¹¹³⁶ was born on 27 June 1799 in GERMANY - Bremen.¹¹⁶⁴ He was baptized on 30 June 1799 at St Peter's Cathedral in GERMANY - Bremen - St Peter's Cathedral.¹¹⁸⁰ The Translations are mine – Trent Niemann – unfortunately language is not carried in the genes but have been done with the help of a Google translator .. any errors are probably due to the fact that word by word translation sometimes misses the true meaning.

Kirchengemeinde St. Petri Dom, Taufen 1799-1808
Church St Peter Cathedral Baptisms
[page19, section 7, Anno 1799]
Johann Heinrich Niemann ehel. geb. den 27ten u. get. Den
Born 27th June
30ten Juny, der Vater Frantz Wilhelm Niemann, ein Arbeitsmann
30th June Father working man
die Mutter Anna Rebecka geb. Karns; Gevatter Johann
mother nee Godfather
Hinrich Blatter.

Cathedral of St Peters, Baptisms 1799 – 1808
Johann Heinrich Niemann born 27th June 1799
Father: Frantz Wilhelm Niemann, working Man
Mother: Anna Rebekka nee Karns
Godfather: Johann Heinrich Blatter
He immigrated on 28 October 1846 to Adelaide SA - on the 'Heerjeebhoy Rustomjee Patel'.^{1127,1181,1182} Heerjeebhoy Rustomjee Patel, 510 tons, Captain Eugene Laun, from Bremen 27th June 1846, arrived at Port Adelaide, South Australia 29th October 1846

The South Australian Register Saturday October 31, 1846

Wednesday October 28 1848:— The Ship Heerjeebhoy Rustomjee Patel, 510 tons, Laun, Master, from Bremen. Passengers: Mr. Meyer (Merchant), Mr. Weichmein (Merchant) and wife, Mr. Wirsh (Horticulturist), Shwomberg (Ship-Builder), Mr. Richter (Farmer), Mr. Bohlmann (Machinist), wife and child, Mr Faas (Merchant), and Dr. Schumann (Surgeon), in the cabin.
Niemann Johann Heinrich n/a Joiner 1170/3 -
Tabitha Margaretha n/a
child n/a
child n/a
child n/a
child n/a
child n/a

The following are brief notes about Adelaide at the time of the arrival of the Niemann Family:
1840s
1840: The first portion of Government House is completed, becoming the first in Australia. The Corporation of Adelaide is founded as the first municipal authority in Australia, and James Hurtle Fisher is elected mayor. An agricultural show, which will become the Royal Adelaide Show, is first held in the yard of Fordham's Hotel in Grenfell Street.
1841: Construction begins of Adelaide Gaol, and the first section is completed. The Adelaide Hospital (later Royal) is opened.
1843: The first Legislative Council building is opened on North Terrace.
1844: The colonial Government takes control of the Corporation of Adelaide.
1847: St Peter's College is established.
1848: Pulteney Grammar School is established. The Savings Bank of South Australia begins trading from a room in Gawler Place.
1849: City Commissioners are nominated to manage Adelaide.
Johann was naturalized on 30 December 1848 in South Australia [1862ER].¹¹⁸³ ' ... and the name Niemann is included with the nine other successful pioneer reefers in Bendigo during the quartz era in the 1860's, ; F Cussack's book 'Bendigo a History'' Between 1854 and 1886 he was a Cabinet maker, mine owner, boarding house keeper.¹¹⁸⁴ He died on 22 June 1886 in Eaglehawk Vic. It is worth noting that Johann Heinrich died after four of his children. The last I do not have a death date for. Johann was buried on 24 June 1886 in Eaglehawk Vic. Bendigo Cemetery Trust advised (2010) that in addition to Johann Heinrich & Johann Conrad, there was a Roseanna EYRE buried in the grave 1st June 1904.
The "right of burial" was normally passed down to the surviving eldest who would have given permission for her to be buried in that grave.

Janine Jones found the following record:
Eyre Rosanna
Death
Father: Boland Michl Mother: Esther Donnellan
Place: Ehawk Year: 1904
Reg No: 4713
Grave : Grave Mon A2 Grave 242 [Photo]¹¹⁸⁵ Parents: Franz Wilhelm NIEMANN-51 and Anna Rebecca KÖRNS (NIEMANN)-52.

Spouse: Tobete Margrete OSTERMANN (NIEMANN)-50. Tobete Margrete OSTERMANN (NIEMANN) and Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN^1186,1187 were married on 22 January 1833 in GERMANY - Bremen - Groplingen 'in the home of the Bride's parents.¹¹⁸⁸ Included in the Media items is a copy of the original certificate and also a translation which could now be open to further interpretation as there is some additional information regarding Bremen, the Niemann's etc. [ the bride's father Johann August Ostermann was a School Teacher not the Mayor ] They^¹¹⁸⁸ lived at California Gully, in a brick house with tent next door in Bendigo Vic about 1854. Family Arrival in Australia
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~leadbeater/passengerlists/

NIEMANN Johann Heinrich, wife Tabita Mgtha, 5 ch (inc Fried August, Ernst August?) arrived 1846-10-28 on Heerjeebhoy Rustomjee Patel from Bremen 1846-06-27 [4,6,7]

The above is strong confirmation of the Niemann's arrival. The parents, number of children, the time-line and the voyage origin. However, the note " (inc Fried August, Ernst August? ) [ not my question mark ] is a little concerning because none of their children were Fried ... Friedrich, is assumed, or Ernst August.

There is a story that they arrived on the 'Red Jacket' in Melbourne 1858. This gives rise to the story that Thomas Devine was on the same ship, fell in love with Lucy and married her 24 hours after they landed. This seems rather spurious but not to be totally dismissed as often these stories end up being more than a grain of truth.

The Niemann Family history book written by Jessie Cafiso provides a comprehensive setting for our Niemann's in Bendigo. [ There was at least one other Niemann family].

The historical text 'Bendigo the German Chapter' does however provide some additional insight into the German involvement. Indeed Germans were the third largest group on the Gold fields and it is suggested numbered as many as 20,000. It is also claimed there were 'six to eight thousand Diggers from South Australia' .P 14

'Sponsored migration with agents or sponsors operating out of Sydney, Melbourne or Adelaide with counterparts in Bremen or Hamburg were customary' P 13

Trent Niemann's comments:
As I have moved around Australia following the path of my various families I have been both amazed and intrigued how the families bring history to life. As a current resident (2006) of the Barossa Valley in South Australia, the German history in that area is 'on every corner'. Until my recent visit to Bendigo I was not aware of the German connection between South Australia and Bendigo. Miners moved around the diggings in Kapunda S.A., Bendigo & Ballarat and even to New Zealand. Later as was the case for my family some moved from those fields to Broken Hill NSW and other mining centres.
'Most Germans, however , reaching the NSW & Victorian Goldfields from the 1850's onward were displaced rural workers or artisans and rarely affluent'. P 12 The German Chapter

The German contribution is not as strongly evident in present day Bendigo. However, it is there with a little 'digging below the surface'. There are parallels too. The wine industry was emerging in Bendigo until it was virtually wiped out by disease.
Our family, as far as I am able to ascertain did not come from 'Mining stock' but some were converted to it, which was true of my immediate family. A number of my family perished, directly or indirectly as a result of mining itself or the conditions that existed in mining centres. 'a major hazard then, as now was dust' [silicosis]
I have also been intrigued by the lack of German tradition and traits in my immediate family especially when compared to some of the German enclaves, such as the Barossa Valley. I taught in such an enclave in the SA mallee and my family 'tradition' had almost nothing in common with the families there.
When I discovered that my Great Grandfather married an Irish Catholic (Nolan) I was surprised because in other settlements the German groups married within the group. The book Bendigo the German Chapter, provided some enlightenment in this regard. 'Marriage outside of the community [German] does not appear to have been frowned upon or to have been the grounds for ostracism, though probably in the early years, marriage within the community or within an ethnic counterpart was to be preferred' P 139
Jessie Cafiso indicates that English became the first language of the Niemann family, and indeed the younger immigrants never learnt German. In Adelaide the children attended a Church of England Grammar school. It seems therefore the Niemann's took a conscious decision to adopt the predomionant culture of their new home. None of the family returned to Germany ... but then again none made their fortune from the diggings.
Only recently have I become aware that the Niemann's held mining leases. Once again 'The German Chapter' provides evidence of this;
Johann Heinrich Niemann 'owned Cinderella mine, Long Gully, for a number of years. The following records are also provided:(P 256)
Niemann Christian Typo Co. 16/9/1868 80 yards
Niemann Christian New Chance Co. 22/4/1869 320 yds 'Flyblow'
Niemann J. Allot 4 Alley St. 24/11/1870 1/4 Acre
Niemann Johann D Fortuna Co. 27/3/1865 80 yds 'Pringles'
Niemann Johann D Fortuna Co. 3/7/1865 80 Yds 'Pringles'
Niemann Johann D Fortuna Co. 27/3/1865 80 Yds 'Pringles'
Niemann John A Fortuna Co 3/7/1865 80 Yds 'Pringles'
Niemann John A Solo co. 25/10/1869 63x108 'Britannia'
Niemann John A Solo Co. 25/10/1869 63v108 'Britannia'
Niemann John A. Ironbark (Whites) 26/6/1871 1/2 Acre 'Ironbark'
Niemann John Allot 16 Sec 51c 1/9/1871 1/4 Acre Off Violet St.
There is no record or evidence that the Niemanns made any successful finds, nor whether Johann Diedrich Conrad, my Great Grandfather died as a result of working in his own or the mines of others. Apparently Silicosis was bad enough but when compounded by T.B. it was certain death.

It seems that as the family grew and subsequently branched little effort was made to maintain extended connections. As a child my family holidays included Bendigo, but I have no recollection of any meetings with extended family.

Sat --- 24 1886 New Zealand Nelson Evening Mail
(Easter) RAWSON, 11 Ap, Motueka, wife of A P Rawson, a son
CLARKE, 22 Ap, Parsonage, Collingwood, wife of Rev A P Clarke, a daughter
GREEN - NIEMANN, 21 Ap, Spring Grove, Felix Matthew, youngest son of William Green, Richmond, to Mary Jane, only daughter of the late Ferdinand Niemann of Spring Grove

Immigrant Ships
Transcribers Guild
Bark Creole

Bremen, Germany to Galveston, Texas
8 July 1852
DISTRICT OF TEXAS – PORT OF GALVESTON
List of Passengers which arrived at the Port of Galveston, the District of Texas during the quarter ending September 30th, 1852

70 Conrad Niemann 42 M Mason 71 Maria Niemann 44 F 72 Friedrich Niemann 16 M 73 Carl Niemann 11 M 74 Sophie Niemann 6 F

New Zealand Shipping Nov 22nd 1866 - probably no relation
The cutter Petrel, Niemann, master, sailed yesterday for Coromandel, with 14 passengers, <&o.

Children were: Johann August "[Stillborn]" NIEMANN-5395, Christian NIEMANN-55, Johannn August "John" NIEMANN-56, Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN-26, Lucy NIEMANN (DEVINE) ( WINSTANLEY)-57, Johann Heinrich "John Henry" NIEMANN Jr-58.

Johann Heinrich "John Henry" NIEMANN Jr¹¹⁸⁹ was born on 28 May 1842 in GERMANY - Bremen. He was a Zinc worker. He lived possibly aTin Smith [see notes] in NEW ZEALAND - Christchurch in 1863. Sue Kelly found the following reference from New Zealand. "J.H. Niemann, occupation Tin & Copper Smith, residence Market Square, Christchurch. " [ not dated ]

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ourstuff/claims_to_voteChA-E.htm
The above is a web site which lists residents of Christchurch "Claims to Vote, Electoral district of Christchurch for the year 1963" John Henry is ASSUMED ( a calculated guess), to have died before 1942 in AUSTRALIA - possibly Parents: Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN-49 and Tobete Margrete OSTERMANN (NIEMANN)-50.

Spouse: Hariett Lucy UNWIN (NIEMANN)-2155. Hariett Lucy UNWIN (NIEMANN) and Johann Heinrich "John Henry" NIEMANN Jr were married on 31 March 1864 in NEW ZEALAND - Christchurch - St Michael's Church. http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ourstuff/claims_to_voteChA-E.htm
The above is a refenence to a William Unwin of Salisbury St. Christchurch who "Claims to vote Electoral district of Christchurch for the year 1863" There is no evidence that this person is related to Hariett Lucy Unwin.

Thank you for you enquiry. I have looked up the Mariage Register for the date of this marriage and unfortuantely I am unable to tell you very little more. This is because New Zealand did not require the names of the parents to be included on the mariage entry until the 1880's.
The register does however show that both the parties signed their names, and that Harriet was a minor - i.e. under age. The officiating Minister was Henry Jacobs and Sarah Hobson of Christchurch and John B Hobson of Christchurch, Law Clerk were the witnesses.

If you wish to make contact with the Presbyterian archivists in Dunedin, type Presbyterian Archives+ New Zealand into Google and the contact infromation can be found from the web site which will turn up.
I hope this helps you in your research.
Yours sincerely
Jane
Children were: Harriett Laura NIEMANN (SPENCE)-2156, Lucy Annie NIEMANN (THOMAS)-2157.

Johannn August "John" NIEMANN was born on 27 December 1836 in GERMANY - Bremen.¹¹⁹⁰ He immigrated in 1846 to Adelaide SA. He was educated in 1846 in Adelaide - Church of England Grammar School. John relocated to in Bendigo Vic - / Eaglehawk in 1853, he was carrier between Melbourne and the Gold fields. The exact date of John moving to Bendigo is not known, the earliest record is 1864. However, the family moved about 1852, John would have been 16 at that time. It is almost certain he moved to Bendigo with the family.
He is listed as an adult at California Gully [ Electoral roll no. 1862 and Claimholder for Fortuna Co., 80 yds, Pringles [1865R]. House & Land Holder - owner in Langston St., Bendigo ... and other numerous holdings in buildings & land.
At some point prior to 1884 he was the Secretary of The Bendigo United Friendly Societies Medical Institute. According to Jessie Cafiso "A Niemann Family history" he originated the Medical Institute, the first of its kind in Australia.
A report in the Bendigo Advertiser 5/8/1869, indicates he was a miner at that time. "Yesterday, a man named Auguste Niemann whilst working in the Garden Gully Tribute Co's. claim, received a severe blow from a stone detached by a shot from a drive which knocked him down and bruised his leg & foot so severely that the assistance of Dr. H Boyd hyad to be sought. The accident was peculiar as showing the danger which mines are subject to notwithstanding ordinary precautions being taken. When the shot went off the men were standing, for safety well in a cross drive, some distance towards the shaft and the stone which inflicted the injury must have struck the side of the level, rebounding from there at a right angle into the drive." As all the Niemann boys were 'Johann', the use of second names was a most like method of distinguishing them. However, he was called John by the family.

He relocated to in NEW ZEALAND - Invercargill in 1860, John was Licenced Victualler Sue Kelly found the following reference from New Zealand: " J.A. Niemann, occupation - Carter, residence Gloucester St. West Christchurch" [ not dated ]

Timaru Herald 1865 Saturday 13th May page 4 Sailed. May 10 - Geelong for Lyttelton. Passenger - Messrs H.J. LeCren, T.W. Hall, Niemann and Allen.

He lived unknown occupation in NEW ZEALAND - Christchurch, Gloucester St. in 1863. He relocated to in Bendigo Vic - then known as Sandhurst in 1867, John was founder of the Medical institute, McRae St Bendigo He relocated to in Sale Vic in 1877, he was Artesian well sinker. The 'Gippsland times' [Sale Vic] reproduced articles under the banner "Headlines from history" in January 2007.
The heading 'Securing Water' 26th Jan 1880 outlines the pivotal role played by J.A. Niemann in sinking a bore and securing the first Artesian water for Sale. [ the complete article is included in the list of photographs]
Footnote:
This article was sent to me by Alf & Vi Chown of Sale, whom we met for one night in St. George, Queensland in 2004. It is somewhat remarkable they remembered my interest in J A Niemann and his connection to Sale. John died T.B. on 11 December 1885 in Sale Vic. He was buried after 11 December 1885 in Sale Vic. Grave : unmarked Parents: Johann HEINRICH NIEMANN-49 and Tobete Margrete OSTERMANN (NIEMANN)-50.

Spouse: Living. Children were: John Henry "Harry" NIEMANN-96, William NIEMANN-97, Christian NIEMANN-98, Mary Simpson "Minnie" NIEMANN (HARRIS)-99, Alice Harriett NIEMANN-100, Wilhelm [ William ] August NIEMANN-101, Johanna Augusta "Gus" NIEMANN (EDWARDS)-102, Arthur August NIEMANN-103, Franz NIEMANN-104, Frederick Conrad "Fred" NIEMANN-105, Albert Norman "Norm" NIEMANN-106.

John NIEMANN¹¹³⁶ was born on 6 June 1864 in Bendigo Vic - assumed. He died on 9 June 1864 in Bendigo Vic - California Gully. He was buried on 9 June 1864 in Bendigo Vic - White Hills. There is no record of his burial at White Hills, Eaglehawk or Bendigo and no grave was found. It is possible he is buried in Grave C16 Eaglehawk with the four other children, Anne, Michael, Sarah & John August. Bendigo Biographical indicates White Hills. Grave : Eaglehawk C16 with siblings & ?Welsh [photo] Parents: Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN-26 and Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN)-27.

John August NIEMANN^1139,1173 was born on 13 October 1878 in Eaglehawk Vic. He died (drowned) on 18 March 1881 in Eaglehawk Vic - Shellback Road. He was buried about 19 March 1881 in Eaglehawk Vic.¹¹⁹¹ Grave : C16; Grv No. 002516 [Photo] There is some doubt that John August is in this grave. And the record shows the name 'Welsh' which also requires research.
His name is listed as Nieman [ not Niemann ] in burial records at Bendigo cemeteries trust. Additional source Eaglehawk cemetery records: Buried in same grave as Michael Henry and Ann Mary.
Accidently drowned Parents: Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN-26 and Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN)-27.

John Ernst Christian NIEMANN was born on 21 September 1873 in Bendigo Vic - Ironbark, Alley St..¹¹⁹² He died in 1931 in Melbourne Vic - Collingwood.¹¹⁹³ He was buried in 1931 in Melbourne Vic - Fawkner. Grave : Melbourne Vic - Fawkner John Ernst Christian Niemann C of E Comp O Grv 2797 Ref 38649 A burial records at Fawkner Cemetery - Melbourne 'John Ernest Christine [ Father was Christian] requires a death certificate for confirmation.
NOT Altona or Springvale Also Known as John Ernest Christian Niemann Parents: Christian NIEMANN-55 and Charlotte JENKINSON (NIEMANN)-1649.

Spouse: Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN)-4754. Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN) and John Ernst Christian NIEMANN were married in 1893 in Bendigo Vic. Children were: Ernst NIEMANN-4755, Clement Edward NIEMANN-4756, Myrtle May NIEMANN-4757, Eva Isabella NIEMANN-4758, Iris Hellen NIEMANN-4759, John Frederick NIEMANN-4760, Living, Living.

John Frederick NIEMANN was born in 1906 in Carlton Vic.¹¹⁹⁴ He died in 1972 in Heidelberg Vic.¹¹⁹⁵ Parents: John Ernst Christian NIEMANN-1654 and Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN)-4754.

John Henry "Harry" NIEMANN¹¹⁹⁶ was born on 24 June 1864 in NEW ZEALAND - Dunedin. Between 1899 and 1926 he was a Pharmacist / Mining / Journalist in Northern Territory - Daly River & Pine Creek.^1197,1198 John Niemann was a man of many talents: Chemist, Factory Manager,Mine Manager, Assayist, Clerk of the Courts and a reference was found of him as a botanist - plant collector.
In 2010 I ( Trent Niemann) travelled to the Daly River in the Northern Territory to 'experience' the flavour of the life of John & Mary in that district.
While we travelled by sealed road and they by water, it was easy to understand the isolation they must have experienced especially during the 'wet' season. We 'camped' in our air conditioned caravan in a shady park with all amenities. However, I still believe it possible to sense what life was like for them.
During our stay we followed a narrow and winding track to the old copper mine where John was firstly the assayist and later the manager. We found the graves of the miners who had been 'mured' - murdered by the aboriginals. We crossed the Day at the river crossing but sadly misunderstood directions given as to where John & Mary lived. We believed they lived where the existing Aboriginal community stands. It seems there is little left of the house they lived in as it was frequently flooded and eventually abandoned. It was originally built by the Jesuit priests and was quite spacious, cool and an enjoyable place to live. It also had extensive gardens and goat herds.
We visited the Aboriginal Community. It has to be one of the 'success' stories for Aboriginal communities if outward appearances count. The entire place was well cared for, grass mowed, buildings painted and yards tidy.
It was a school day and a few children seen were 'happy & healthy' , not something we always saw around the 'top end'.
A short visit to the pub found a few people drinking light beer, playing pool and sitting quietly in small groups. They were welcoming and happy to talk about living on 'The Daly'. They pointed out the photos of the big floods and talked about their evacuation.
The owner of the caravan park was interested in the local history and sold me a copy of the book "The Spirit of the Daly" by Peter Forrest. The Niemann's are frequently mentioned.
As a footnote I was travelling with my brother who was the Solicitor to the Northern Land Council in the early 1980's and he travelled to the Daly. It was also quite an experience for him.
We did not travel anywhere by boat; nothing short of trip to the mouth of the Daly would suffice as to some extent the river looked like any other. As with other rivers in the 'Top End' the indications of the high water mark is a clue to how spectacular and isolating it must be in flood time. Add to the fact that crocodiles and snakes also rise with the river !

Pine Creek Post Office and Repeater Station
Location
Lot 155, Town of Pine Creek.

Gazettal Date
31 May 1995.
Northern Territory Government Gazette No. G22.

Description
to be provided

Statement of Heritage Value
The building, which is now locally referred to as the "repeater station", was originally erected at Burrundie as the Chief Mining Warden's quarters. Completed in 1889 it served as accommodation and office space for the Mining Warden at Burrundie until 1905 when the position was transferred to Pine Creek. The building at Burrundie continued in use by the Mines Department, accommodating the Assistant Warden. In 1913 the building was dismantled and transferred to Pine Creek to serve as the quarters for the Chief Mining Warden E.C.Playford. This building was one of a number of buildings which have been transferred to Pine Creek from another location as a result of the economic activities associated with mining in the Northern Territory.
When the position of Chief Mining Warden was transferred to Darwin the building was once again occupied by the assistant mining warden, John Niemann who was also the local Chemist. During its history the building has been used as a Doctor's residence, a clinic, as staff quarters for the Pine Creek half-caste home, as a hospital and a military communications centre and Post Office during World War 2. The building continued in use as a Post Office and residence after the War and in the 1970s an automatic telephone exchange was installed.
The building has had a number of local identities associated with it, including Edward Copley Playford, Clyde Fenton and John Niemann.

John Henry as a botanist
Maurice Holtze was government gardener of the Palmerston Botanic Gardens (i.e. today's George Brown Darwin Botanic Gardens) from 1878 to 1891 and he was succeeded as head of the Garden by his son Nicholas. Both father and son collected plant specimens for Mueller in Melbourne and their collections are still housed in the National Herbarium of Victoria.
Other collectors for this time include J.E. Tennison-Woods (1886, with Maurice Holtze), J.H. Niemann, E.J. Dunn and R.J. Winters (1904, 1913) and W.S. Campbell (1911).
He lived Chemist in Adelaide - Glenside, Greenhill Road in 1927. Harry died on 19 March 1942 in Adelaide SA. He was buried after 19 March 1942 in Adelaide SA - Centennial Park.¹¹⁹⁹ Grave : General Row: Path: 15 Site: 956 Parents: Johannn August "John" NIEMANN-56 and Living.

Spouse: Ellen Mary "Nellie Helen" WEBSTER (NIEMANN)-107. Ellen Mary "Nellie Helen" WEBSTER (NIEMANN) and John Henry "Harry" NIEMANN were married on 24 May 1888 in Sydney NSW.¹²⁰⁰ Children were: Alice Webster NIEMANN (WILSON)-108.

Spouse: Mary NICOLSON (NIEMANN)-109. Mary NICOLSON (NIEMANN) and John Henry "Harry" NIEMANN were married in 1896 in Armadale Vic..¹⁰⁹⁶ They^¹⁰⁹⁶ lived in Northern Territory - Victoria River Station in 1896. Victoria River Downs (VRD)
The Big Run
On 12 September 1819, Philip Parker King discovered the mouth of the Victoria River. Twenty years later, in 1839, Captain J. C. Wickham arrived at the same spot in the HMS Beagle. Crew members of the Beagle followed the river upstream into the interior for more than 200 kilometres.

In August 1854, Augustus Charles Gregory, assistant surveyor in Western Australia, was appointed leader of the North Australian Expedition. When they set off in 1855 from Moreton Bay it would be more than a year before they returned safe and well to Brisbane. They explored large areas of the Victoria River catchment area and went as far as 500 kilometres south to the edge of the Great Sandy Desert. The expedition was a great success and once and for all proved that there was no inland sea but plenty of land suitable for pastoral development.

Members of the expedition were his brother H.C. Gregory, Dr (Sir) Ferdinand Jacob Heinrich von Mueller, botanist, J.R. Elsey, surgeon, J.S. Wilson, geologist, J. Baines, artist and storekeeper, J. Flood, J. Fahey, H. Richards, G. Phibbs, C. Humphries, R. Bowman, C. Dean, J. Melville, W. Shewell, W. Dawson, W. Selby and S. MacDonald.

Some considered the country good enough to establish a tropical State, called Albert, after Queen Victoria's husband, with its capital on the Victoria River. However in 1863 the Northern Territory was annexed by South Australia. One early visitor to the region was Rev Julian Edmund Tenison Woods who travelled south from Darwin and called the river the Australian River Nile. Another well known visitor was John Flynn. In 1895, as a fifteen year old, he experienced first hand the rugged conditions of the outback when he was marooned for a month on a sandbar in the Victoria River.

Among some of the first to take out leases in the district were Charles Brown Fisher, born in London on 25 September 1817 and Maurice Lyons, a Melbourne Magistrate. Fisher was the second son of James Hurtle Fisher and had by 1875 become one of the wealthiest men in Australia. Together they stocked Victoria River Downs in the early 1880s. Most of the stock was overlanded by Nathaniel Buchanan who set out from Wilmot in 1881 with 20,000 head of cattle.

Buchanan had been, and still was, associated with the opening up and stocking of several stations in the Victoria River district and the Ord River region. Born in Ireland in 1826, he arrived in New South Wales with his father in 1832. He later conducted several exploring expeditions in Northern Australia with William Landsborough. In 1896 he assisted L.A. Wells to find his cousin Charles who had perished during the Calvert Expedition.

Fisher and Lyons also appointed Lindsay Crawford as manager. Crawford had been one of Charles Todd's men on the Overland Telegraph construction team and telegraph operator at Daly Waters. After many initial difficulties, and almost financial ruin Fisher was able to profit from his hard work and investment before the station was sold to Goldsbrough Mort & Co.

With white population slowly increasing in and around the district and an Aboriginal population of some 4000, Mounted Constable Willshire, formerly of the Central Australian Police Corps was stationed at Gordon Creek in 1894 to maintain law and order. This really meant keeping the Aborigines 'in line' on what would become Australia's largest pastoral property and cattle station in the world.

After Lindsay Crawford's resignation in 1894, Goldsborough appointed Jack Watson from neighbouring Auvergne station as the new manager. During his time the station consisted of 21,000 square kilometres and had 30,000 cattle and some 500 working horses. Watson died on 1 April 1896 while swimming stock across the Katherine River. He was replaced by his brother Robert. When Robert and his family arrived, his wife became the first white woman to live on the station.

On 30 January 1900, the station was sold to a syndicate made up of Sidney Kidman, Alexander Forrest and Isadore Emanuel who appointed Denis James Ronan as manager. He was later replaced by Richard Townsend. Alf Martin took over in 1926 and became its longest serving manager from 1926 until 1945.

During his years at the station he had many visitors among them the Governor of South Australia, Sir George Le Hunte in 1905 and Larry Wells, who surveyed the district in 1907. Other frequent visitors were Mick Madrill, who started a mail run, Randell Stafford and Harry Peckham, much better known as 'The Fizzer' from the book We of the Never Never.

Born in February 1872 in Adelaide, Peckham worked as a stockman at Renner Springs before he secured a mail contract in 1902. He obtained the mail contract for VRD in November 1907. He became well known and liked by every body in the remote outback. While attempting to deliver an urgent letter, seeking medical attention for a seriously ill woman on Victoria River Downs, he drowned swimming the flooded Dashwood crossing. His body was later recovered and buried on the river bank but later re-interred at the Elsey Station Cemetery on 14 September 1944.

Victoria River Downs was sold in March 1909 to Bovril Australian Estates for £180,000 with Sidney Kidman becoming a member of the Board of Directors until 1922. Although some reasonable profits had been made before the sale to Bovril, matters improved vastly when meatworks were built at Darwin by Vestey Brothers and by the Western Australian government at Wyndham. When the railway was extended from Pine Creek to Katherine transport costs were reduced remarkably. It also reduced the isolation of the district to some extent.

Nearby Humbert River station remained as Crown Land after VRD was formed and was taken up in about 1903 under Pastoral Permit by Newton and Kearney in 1903. It was resumed by the SA government in 1908 for use as an Aboriginal reserve, but this never happened. Billy Butler obtained a Grazing Licence in 1914 and he sold this to C.F. Schultz in 1919.

In 1919 Thomas Graham was appointed manager. During 1922 there was an outbreak of malaria Humbert River station, which caused the death of more than ten per cent of the station workers. Sister E.M. King, of the Australian Inland Mission, turned the homestead into a hospital to care for the sick and dying. Later a proper hospital was built which became known as Wimmera House. It closed down in 1942. Both the original homestead, which is located some kilometres south of the current Victoria River Downs homestead, and the hospital are now listed as part of the National Estate.

In August 1926 Alfred Martin became the new manager and had his wife and large family living with him at Victoria River Downs at the head station on the Wickham River. He still faced many problems such as low beef prices and later the 1930s depression. Martin, a butcher by trade had first worked for Durack but later went droving. From then on he managed Carlton, the VRD bullock depot at Wyndham for seventeen years. Martin turned out a great administrator and knew all there was to know of the meat industry.

During his time, VRD had its first official race meeting. In later years proceeds of these meetings went to the Royal Flying Doctor Service. Hell-fire Martin, as became known, remained on VRD until 1945, carrying the station through droughts, depression, war and resumptions. He retired through ill health and was replaced by Hartley Magnussen. Since that time the Big Run has been carved up leaving only about 12,000 square kilometres.

Well known carver, dancer and painter, Alan Griffiths was born in January 1933 at Victoria River Downs Station where he lived and worked as a stockman until 1957. In 1965 he went to Argyle Station where he married his promised wife Peggy. Alan and Peggy performed the Bali Bali Balga ceremony for the 1997 National Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Art Award.

In 1960 the station was bought by Hooker Corporation, from William Buckland, who made many improvements, particularly in transport. By this time it employed a hundred men and the homestead had the appearance of a small country town. There was the manager's house, a store, kitchen, mess, offices, radio room, single men's quarters, bakery, blacksmith, saddlery, workshops and garages.

The station was sold once more in 1984 to Peter Sherwin for $12,000,000. By 1986 Sherwin had become Australia's largest cattle breeder. It was also during his time that heli-mustering, the rounding up of cattle by helicopter, first started as early as 1970, became very popular. Finally in October 1989 VRD was bought by Robert Holmes a' Court through his Heytesbury Pastoral Company. After his death in 1990, his wife Janet took over. The Big Run has since enjoyed the most stable and profitable period in its 120-year history, entrenching its status as the king of cattle stations.
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October 2006
My interest in john & Mary Niemann was sparked by becoming aware of two books. "The Spirit of the Daly" Peter Forrest & Life on the Daly river" Nancy Polishuk.
John Niemann and his second wife Mary must have been quite amazing people. He was born New Zealand, moved to Sandhurst ( Bendigo), studied in Melbourne and became a Chemist, married his first wife Alice Webster, who died in Warracknabeal Vic. He married Mary nee Nicolson in Sydney.

John & Mary headed for the Northern Territory and at great risk attempted to set up a meat extract business at Victoria River. Victoria River was completely isolated and they almost came to grief on the sea voyage there. Their short stay there wasn't any improvement upon the voyage ! That didn't last long before they moved to the Daly River. At that time it also required a sea & river journey.
Both of the books mentioned, illustrate that the 'Daly' is a littany of failure, floods, crocodiles, snakes and during the wet season almost total isolation. There were very few settlers in the area even after World War 2.
The Aboriginal people were their only company and provided most of the labour for the farms, the mines and any other endeavour. By 1899 they were apparently 'peaceful' people, one suspects because they never forgot the massacres that took place after some Aboriginals killed miners in 1884. They were subsequently hunted and it is estimated 150 men women & children were murdered.
The privations for John, Mary and the two girls would have been no less than for any other settler. However both books convey a sense of community which provided something quite special & necessary !
With some understanding, but no personal experience I am totally impressed by the fact that they seemed to have been undaunted by the risks and challenges. It is little wonder they are listed conspicuously amongst the pioneers.
Not satisfied with six years on the Daly, they moved to Pine Creek. Maybe not quite as isolated but nonetheless would have required considerable determination.
The Niemann's are a 'mobile lot' . Others in the family went to New Zealand, Fiji and while closer to home, still daunting, Broken Hill. And one died (suspected murdered) off the coast of Western Australia, having 'chased his fortune' in northern Western Australia.

It is necessary to read the books to gain a better understanding of John & Mary's adventures on the Daly.

The following is an extract from "The Spirit of the Daly"

In 1899 John and Mary Niemann came from Melbourne to the Daly River, to settle at the New Uniya site which the Jesuits had recently abandoned. John Niemann was a_chemist, and he was encouraged by swashbuckling pastoralist Captain Joe Bradshaw (of Bradshaw's Run, on the Fitzmaurice River) to come north to operate a meat extract plant. There was little market for Territory live cattle, and Bradshaw resolved that it might be more profitable to slaughter cattle and to produce meat extract from their carcasses. After an abortive investigation of the Victoria River locality it was decided that the best site for the works would be on the Daly, to whence Bradshaw could walk his cattle overland.
The Niemanns were to spend the next twenty years in the Territory - on the Daly, at Pine Creek, and in Darwin. On her return to Melbourne Mary Niemann wrote a series of articles which were published in the Melbourne Leader newspaper on May 1, 8, 15, 22, 29, June 5, 12, 19, 26, July 3. 1920. Mary vividly recalled their arrival at the old mission, which Neimanns called 'Monea':
[The full article is within the Documents attached to this family ]
[A similar article is in the Niemann family book; especially the account of their brief exploit to Captain Bradshaw's cattle station.]

It is interesting, if not a little bizarre that John 'escaped' from mining to become a Chemist and yet was drawn back into mining when in the Northern Territory. He did return to his work as a Chemist when the family returned to Adelaide.

Children were: Catherine Nicolson "Kit" NIEMANN (HENNESSY)-110.

Leslie "Les" NIEMANN^{1201,1202,1203} was born on 15 August 1917 in Broken Hill NSW. He was an Underground Storeman ( Retired ). He died Old Age on 19 November 2008 in Broken Hill NSW. Family & friends gathered for the funeral service of Uncle Les in Broken Hill. As most of his children, neices & nephews have all put their 60th birthdays behind them, apart from being a sad occasion it was also and opportunity to 'get together'.
Les was the last survivor of his generation of Ernest & Emma's children; it is sobering to know another generation has passed on.
It is hoped that through family history some tangible memories are recorded for posterity and available when the descendants are ready to ask questions about their forebears.
I'm sure many people could claim a special relationship with Uncle Les. I do not expect that I'd be unique.
I remember him as a person who had a clever wit, had time for everybody and seemed to care what was happening in their lives. He had a great love of family and enjoyed family gatherings. The bigger the better. He did not drink but as far as I know had no criticism for those who did. His cooking was legendary. But his understanding of motor mechanics wasn't ! He was quite a handyman and built at least one home which included the making of the bricks from cement.
It never seems much to sum up a life in a few sentences but it isn't really possible to pass on the essence of an individual or their relationship to each of us.
He was a good man . Les was buried after 19 November 2008 in Broken Hill - Cremated -. Les Niemann is a legendary 'bush cook'. Whenever the family camped on the river, especially at Easter, he made bread, hot cross buns, roast dinners in the camp ovens over the camp fire.
Boats weren't owned by the family, any fishing was done from the river bank, Uncle Les decided to build one from flat iron. I visited him regularly to watch it take shape. It was finally finished and the Easter camping trip at Bono station was all planned. When we arrived at the River Darling, Uncle Les couldn't wait to get the boat in the water. In the boat went, Uncle Les climbed in, reached around for the oar and over she went ! A very unstable craft. He scrounged some downpiping from Bono station, lashed it to the side of the boat and this partly addressed its tendency to overtuen. However, few would venture on her. Later he corrected the problem but the boat was always viewed with suspicion.
The roads around Broken Hill were never the best. Aunty Lilly complained about the rough roads and Uncle Les' driving, so he simply passed her the steering wheel as they travelled along.
After he retired he built a home at 'Sunset Strip' on the Menindee lake. He made all of the bricks by hand and constructed the home himself. When there was water in the lake (unlikely to be seen again .. it is said ) the home overlooked a wonderful expanse of water and it lapped at the lawn that stretched from the house to the water's edge.
I visited him a number of times and the last time before Aunty Lilly needed intensive medical treatment in Broken Hill he baked a pie and we joined them for lunch. The food we took was put aside. It wasn't like the camp oven events but still done with lots of skill.
At the time of writing (2005) Uncle Les is the last of my Father's family and I guess the last connection to my father and the last generation of our Niemann's. Uncle Les now lives in Broken Hill.

26/11/2008
Uncle Les passed away on 19/11/2008. Until a little while ago he was 'hale & hearty'; but at 92 years his body said 'enough'. The last of his generation of my father's family ( children of Ernest James Niemann & Emma Jane nee Dorman) has passed on; as he'd say 'that's life'. Parents: Ernest James NIEMANN-8 and Emma Jane DORMAN (NIEMANN)-9.

Spouse: Living. Children were: Living, Living, Living.

Lewis "Lew / Lou" NIEMANN^1204,1205 was born on 14 August 1906 in Broken Hill NSW - probably.^1204,1206 He was a Painter / mill hand in Broken Hill NSW. He died on 3 December 1955 in Sydney NSW - Auburn.^1207,1208 Lew / Lou was buried after 3 December 1955 in Broken Hill NSW. Parents: William John NIEMANN-37 and Emily Edith May "Edith" SPRATT (NIEMANN)-194.

Spouse: Doreen Mary ROBINSON (NIEMANN)-244. Doreen Mary ROBINSON (NIEMANN) and Lewis "Lew / Lou" NIEMANN were married on 6 September 1924 in Broken Hill NSW.¹²⁰⁹ Children were: Arthur William George 'Boof' NIEMANN-245, Living, Living, Living, Living.

Maxwell Ernest "Max" NIEMANN¹¹⁵⁰ was born on 3 October 1930 in Broken Hill NSW. He died in November 1983 in Sydney NSW - probably.^235,1150 He was buried in November 1983 in Sydney NSW - probably. Parents: Ernest Richard NIEMANN-63 and Eileen Isabel IVY CLARK (NIEMANN)-138.

Spouse: Living. Children were: Living, Living.

Michael Henry NIEMANN^{1173,1210,1211} was born on 13 January 1866 in Eaglehawk Vic - / Bendigo - California Gully. [Maybe listed as Henry Michael Niemann] He died of Inflammation of the Lungs on 12 August 1867 in Eaglehawk Vic - / Bendigo - California Gully. He was buried on 13 August 1867 in Eaglehawk Vic. Grave : C16; With Ann Mary, John, Sarah - no headstone [Photo] Parents: Johann Diedrich Conrad NIEMANN-26 and Ann Rose "Rose Anne" NOLAN (NIEMANN)-27.

Michael William NIEMANN⁴⁷ was born on 2 December 1976 in Wagga Wagga NSW.⁴⁷ He died in a road accident on 11 July 1996 in NSW. He was buried about 11 July 1996 in NSW. Parents: Living and Living.

Myrtle May NIEMANN was born in 1898 in Carlton Vic.¹²¹² She died before 1998. Parents: John Ernst Christian NIEMANN-1654 and Emily Jane Christie BURGESS ( NIEMANN)-4754.

Noreen Julia NIEMANN¹⁰⁹⁷ was born in 1924 in Broken Hill NSW - probably. She died on 30 April 1926 in Broken Hill NSW.^48,1097,1213 She was buried after 30 April 1926 in Broken Hill NSW.¹²¹⁴ Grave : Broken Hill - Methodist METH M5 46 44¹¹⁷⁷ Parents: William Henry (Bill) NIEMANN-196 and Beryl NIEMANN (NIEMANN)-225.

Norma Edith NIEMANN was born on 5 November 1906 in Melbourne Vic - Carlton. She lived in Bendigo Vic - 21 Mark St. in 1927. She died of T.B. on 20 November 1927 in Bendigo Vic. Norma was buried on 21 November 1927 in Bendigo Vic.¹²¹⁵ Grave : F1 Lavender Walk 23282 (unmarked) [Photo] Parents: Arthur August NIEMANN-103 and Mabel Inglis DICKSON (NIEMANN)-1664.

Norman MacGillivray NIEMANN was born on 23 December 1912 in Bendigo Vic. He died on 15 February 1986 in Buninyong Vic - [Nr Ballarat] assumed. He was buried after 15 February 1986 in Buninyong Vic. Grave : Buningyong Vic - [Nr Ballarat] assumed Parents: Albert Norman "Norm" NIEMANN-106 and Living.

Spouse: Dorothy H GORDON ( NIEMANN)-119. Dorothy H GORDON ( NIEMANN) and Norman MacGillivray NIEMANN were married in 1937 in Victoria. Children were: Living, Living.

Pamela Joy "Twin" NIEMANN was born in 1939 in Murrawee Vic, near Swan Hill. She died in 1939 in Murrawee Vic, near Swan Hill. She was buried in 1939 in Swan Hill - possibly. Parents: Henry August "Harry" NIEMANN-1666 and Edith Mary MCLEAN (NIEMANN)-1668.

Richard Charles (Dick) NIEMANN^109,1216 was born on 6 July 1899 in Broken Hill NSW.^{109,1205,1217} He was a miner / jockey / horse trainer. He died on 25 November 1976 in Broken Hill NSW.¹²¹⁸ Richard was buried on 26 November 1976 in Broken Hill NSW. Grave : Broken Hill - Uniting M2 R10 Gr5 [Photo]¹²¹⁹ Parents: William John NIEMANN-37 and Emily Edith May "Edith" SPRATT (NIEMANN)-194.

Spouse: Lena BONNER (NIEMANN)-199. Lena BONNER (NIEMANN) and Richard Charles (Dick) NIEMANN were married on 5 March 1921.¹¹² Children were: Living, Living, Living.